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| No. Not exactly. |
I reserved the original 3DS model, but then canceled my pre-order on it and I still have not purchased a Nintendo 3DS system. Nintendo announced a new 3DS model, the 3DS XL, just over a week ago now.
Was the new 3DS XL model shown what I was hoping for, and were the announcements at/since E3 for the 3DS system enough to get me excited about Nintendo's 3D handheld system? Maybe it was Capcom's Monster Hunter 4 3DS reveal today? Actually, neither one yet.
What should have Nintendo's 3DS XL, or even just a new 3DS model in the future, look like that would get me interested in the console, perhaps enough to even buy one for if/when Monster Hunter 4 releases in the U.S. next year?
Brew yourself some coffee, and let's take a look at two 3DS XL redesign options, that are better than the Nintendo 3DS XL's current design...at least in my caffeinated opinion. THESE are what the 3DS XL should have looked like!
The Brew
Coffee's 3DS XL (lower) Model. It would have the same screen size as the 3DS XL, just with two circle pads instead of only one:
Coffee's 3DS XL (top) Model. It would have the same screen size as the newly announced 3DS XL system, but with two top circle pads instead of only one:
Did you notice the new power button location? Not only would these new 3DS XL models have two circle pads built into the system, but the system's "POWER" button has been relocated as well, clearing up the space beneath the new circle pad and/or ABXY buttons.
Caffeinated Thoughts
Why would this be a better design? Well, the additional circle pad makes the already announced 3DS XL Circle Pad Pro a non-issue, and new shoulder buttons will be able to be implemented as well. Because, in the design world anything is possible, even though it might not be probable.
I think a 3DS system with two circle pads being standard, would give the 3DS a new control option for developers opening up more opportunities for them, not limiting them.
I personally think Nintendo has missed a market opportunity with the 3DS XL model, by leaving off a 2nd Circle Pad. When Nintendo announced the 3DS XL last week during their Nintendo Direct conference, I thought my eyes were fooling me and the empty space on the "new" system would magically reveal a 2nd Circle Pad. Unfortunately, that did not happen.
If Nintendo had shown the new 3DS XL system that looked like either of the above, it would have immediately moved the system to the top of my consoles wish list. I would have seen it as Nintendo being serious about providing better/more control options, instead of telling consumers to duck tape attachments to the existing 3DS systems for better/more control options.
In short, for skimmers...
Questions
Are any of you non-3DS owners, perhaps like me, that have been holding off on purchasing a 3DS system, because you are waiting on a new 3DS system design, and if so, was the 3DS XL announcement and design what you had been waiting for? Would either of the "new" 3DS models I showed above, have been what you were looking for in a new 3DS system instead of what Nintendo has done?
If you already own a current 3DS model, do you plan on buying the new 3DS XL model when it releases next month?
If you are interested in the 3DS XL, you can see some picture links below for the "Red" and "Blue" systems being offered:
Please Cry More $ONY Ho!!..Glad You're Mad and Sad. 3DS Kicks Your Vita's Face and Butt Real Hard. ROFL
ReplyDeleteLooks like someone has been uneasy looking at 3DS sales soaring over vita. You can sense the author's sadness indeed.
ReplyDeleteYEP. He should get more coffees to drink. Lul.
ReplyDeleteLOL, I don't own a Vita either. I'm not even saying the 3DS' sales are doing terrible here, or that the Vita is better overall...just that I wish Nintendo would have added the 2nd Circle Pad to the system, instead of doing it as another attachment like the original 3DS system.
ReplyDeleteSee above comment reply...^
ReplyDeleteI don't own a Vita, or a 3DS. I hope both companies can sell millions and millions of units, and give developers/gamers more awesome games to play. I just wish the 3DS XL addressed the Circle Pad Pro option, being built-in, and not an accessory.
If you're a current 3DS owner, do you plan on picking up the new 3DS XL?
Thanks for stopping by!
About to brew the second pot of the day right now actually.
ReplyDeleteI've already expressed how I feel about the debate on the second Circle Pad, so I won't go into detail here. However, I did want to say that you brought up a great point that the R&D department at Nintendo should be mindful of; specifically, the part about "duck [taping] attachments." While I have yet to use the Circle Pad Pro and can't offer an informed opinion on how it plays in the games that actually use it, this is one point that I am inclined to agree with.
ReplyDelete"However, I did want to say that you brought up a great point that the R&D department at Nintendo should be mindful of; specifically, the part about 'duck [taping] attachments.'"
ReplyDeleteI know Nintendo put up a lot for their new R&D building back in 2009 I believe, but it won't be done I think until 2014...so perhaps until then the current R&D teams are being told to cut costs with duck tape?
Again, I don't see it as one of those, "If the 2nd Circle Pad was added, it would make the original system outdated..." things, as a simple control standard could fix that easily, while making the 2nd Circle Pad an option for ALL new systems and opening up the market even more to developers.
The thing is, for the Circle Pad Pro to be truly replaced, it would have to have the extra triggers as well, as the 3-4 games so far that make use of the second circle pad also use the triggers. Otherwise, they'd have to release an Extra Trigger Pro too.
ReplyDeleteHaha, that's why I have the, "and new shoulder buttons will be able to be implemented as well. Because, in the design world, while anything is possible, it might not be probable." portion of the post (see just under the "Caffeinated Thoughts" section). Additional shoulder triggers would be added, you just can't see them in the images provided...right?
ReplyDeletePerhaps if Nintendo can't get the should buttons in, an Extra Trigger Pro could have a MSRP of only $9.99 in the U.S., since it's less materials.
Thanks for the comment and stopping by!
#NotSkimmingToday
ReplyDeleteI guess Kazz and 777 didn't get the trolling responses they were looking for..
Anyway, you know my thoughts on it. Probably should have gone with a second circle + triggers just to have the appropriate support for future games without a huge CirclePad Pro XL. (which is ridiculous) It's a missed opportunity.
I haven't purchased any games that support or require the CPP, so it's not a big deal. For me the larger screen size is of more importance, but I don't plan to buy at this time due to the cost factor. I can put that money towards games, which reminds me that I should go look at that GameStop spreadsheet again before the sale ends...
"I think a 3DS system with two circle pads being standard, would give the 3DS a new control option for developers opening up more opportunities for them, not limiting them."
ReplyDeleteNo it wouldnt
If anything it would make things worse
What do you want? another lame vita?
which cant even do shooters right with the sticks?
Lets see what he 3ds adds
ReplyDeleteBigger, better screen
better buttons
better battery
beter stylus placement
no screen scratch
perfect BC
and more
Yeah, its way better
Nintendo DID THE RIGHT THING, by not adding a stick because then you screw 20 million people
if you were a real fan, the AWESOME library would of done it, if you were a gamer that is
ReplyDelete"If anything it would make things worse"
ReplyDeleteHow so?
As for a 2nd Circle Pad, perhaps the fact that Nintendo released the Circle Pad Pro for the original so quickly, says that there were developers requesting it...and we know of one that we're aware of, that has the current best selling 3rd party game on the 3DS, according to a comment earlier on Twitter about it.
"Nintendo DID THE RIGHT THING, by not adding a stick because then you screw 20 million people"
ReplyDeleteSee: "a simple control standard could fix that easily, while making the 2nd Circle Pad an option for ALL new systems and opening up the market even more to developers."
LOL, get too much sun light recently? I have said I'm interested in a few games on the system, but not enough right now to go out and purchase the system.
ReplyDeleteOne of the games I'm most interested in playing on the system, Mutant Mudds, is coming to the PC market, which is one reason less, that I'm interested in the 3DS now.
Yes. I'm trading my original 3ds for a new grey XL.
ReplyDeleteI REALLY liked the bigger screens on my old DsiXL and frankly found it hard to go back to smaller screens when i bought my 3ds.
I still carried my large DsiXL in my pocket so portability wont be an issue.
I dont really care for the second circle pad. I prefer to play shooters on my PS3 anyway. I like to use Handhelds for platformers, puzzlers and racing games.
ahahahahahaha
ReplyDeleteits supported by 4 total games. Thats it, devs, in general dontcare
ReplyDeleteno, because then you would make it so people had to buy the peripheral when most devs dont care about it and most gamers either
ReplyDelete"its supported by 4 total games. Thats it, devs, in general dontcare"
ReplyDeleteI don't blame developers, for not making controls for an attachment that isn't part of the system though. Nintendo should set the standards, by making it available early on. It's like WM+. How many Wii games support it, and how many are good? Wii Balance Board?
Don't make it a "standard" option early on, and developers won't support it. I think the fact that they released it in Japan day one with Monster Hunter Tri 3G, the best selling 3rd party game, shows that certain games will be more comfortable with it.
No. If the NEW 3DS XL had a 2nd Circle Pad, and the standard was, "If your game uses the 2nd Circle Pad, it must also have alternative touch-screen controls." would mean original 3DS owners wouldn't need/miss out on the controls. Comfort maybe, but not an alternative control method.
ReplyDeleteUh, the Vita does shooters fine, actually.
ReplyDeleteBut don't let facts get in the way of your fanboyism! Keep on missing out those great games that are already on Vita :)
3DS - for teen shitcocks.
ReplyDeletePSV - for noble ELITE..
Wow, good to know Coffee cops this... comment quality... as well ;)
ReplyDeleteI know we've had this conversation before, but:
I do still believe that the reason Nintendo didn't include the second control stick is because it would have encouraged third parties to develop games that require the dual-stick controls. Nintendo could mandate developers implement multiple control options, sure, but Nintendo wants to be seen as the open publisher right now (at least, that's its PR line), and it's a rare game where two different control set-ups work as well as one another.
But all that said, as a gamer the only thing that would have convinced me to buy this would have been that second control stick built into the console. I own a Vita, and it does make a big difference.
"Yes. I'm trading my original 3ds for a new grey XL."
ReplyDeleteHave you downloaded many/any eShop games, and holding off on trading it in until you can make sure you transfer all the eShop purchases? Or, do you not have many/any eShop games and trading it off soon?
As for shooters on the PS3, are you playing any shooters on the PS3 currently you would recommend? I've been looking at Ghost Recon Future Soldier, but have held off for now.
LOL, did a little "E for Everyone" rating adjustment there. As for the PSV, you have any game recommendations on it?
ReplyDelete"Nintendo could mandate developers implement multiple control options, sure, but Nintendo wants to be seen as the open publisher right now (at least, that's its PR line)..."
ReplyDeleteLOL, it's gotta be the PR line being fed from NOJ or NOA (Reggie admitted being a puppet master at E3!). I'm just not sure developers are actually buying the PR line anymore, which I guess will be evidenced by the future 3rd Party support for the system though.
We know the Vita is getting a Call of Duty title this holiday season, Declassified...but nothing about a 3DS version yet. Which, I'm actually thinking the 3DS and Wii U version could be announced around the same time. But if the Call of Duty franchise skips the 3DS this year, that would be really odd...considering the DS had several Call of Duty games on it.
I would be absolutely shocked if there wasn't a 3DS COD game this year.
ReplyDeleteThe only reason there might not be one is that we might see one final DS COD game, as that would be cheap to develop, would play fine on a 3DS, and there are 100 million-odd more DS units out there than 3DS'
Activision remains a numbers business, and those numbers are hard to argue against.
I agree, support from the beginning is what they needed. It hurt the WM+ and is doing the same for the 3DS. Probably didn't want to open that can of worms of 'always supporting the alternate control scheme' situations.
ReplyDeleteFor example I believe RE: Revelations and Metal Gear both support the circle pad pro, but without it RE was easier to control for me. Metal Gear's aiming with the ab/xy buttons just felt weird.
you dont understand business. Thats obvious.
ReplyDeleteNow your asking companies to do somethign EVEN MORE ANNOYING
1 standard is better than 2
gamers have spoken by not buying it. Devs have spoken by not supporting it
ReplyDeletelike resistance? which bombed?
ReplyDeleteyou can transfer games easily
ReplyDelete3ds will see cod if it continues to sell at number 1 levels
ReplyDeleteThe CCP was sold out for a good while at many Game Stop locations. I don't even own a 3DS, but I remembered seeing/reading that, here's one:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.modojo.com/features/circle_pad_pro_difficult_to_find/
"EVEN MORE ANNOYING"
ReplyDeleteHaving ONE standard, might be better than NO standard. Nintendo doesn't even have a "3D effect" standard for the 3DS.
Again, the 1 standard would be the touchscreen controls, perhaps you don't understand that (three+ comments now) that have said that. The ONE standard would be, "Every 3DS game uses touchscreen controls, IF it uses Circle Pad controls."
That is ONE standard, but gives developers the chance of two control options.
Drink. More. Coffee. Stay. Out. Of. Sun. :)
Somebody said it was difficult? Sunlight, it'll get you every time!
ReplyDeleteYou can transfer games easily yes, but don't you have to have the ORIGINAL system with the games on it to transfer to the NEW system? It might be easy, but it means waiting on the new system to release, before trading off the old system, right?
no you dont. Do your research
ReplyDeletehttp://www.awesomegames.co.uk/the-3ds-xl-only-has-one-circle-pad-oh-no
ReplyDeletehttp://www.awesomegames.co.uk/the-3ds-xl-only-has-one-circle-pad-oh-no
ReplyDeleteNot only did it not sell out, it didnt sell well
http://www.awesomegames.co.uk/the-3ds-xl-only-has-one-circle-pad-oh-no
ReplyDeleteWow - solid post and well, it's generating lots of traffic. *chuckles*
ReplyDeleteThat said? I think a second circle pad is pretty much a must going forward. Considering the way the Wii started shipping motion plus with their systems and controllers, it only makes sense to me to follow the same model here. That said, not ever dev will embrace it, but then again not ever dev makes use of every button - and I've seen some DS games that hardly use the touchscreen at all. It's a tool - not a requirement, in my opinion.
I have a 3DS - got it for Christmas and sure, the XL probably is a bit shinier and would fit my hands better, but I won't bother to upgrade. I'm perfectly contnet wit h my current model. If I was going to spend those bucks on another unit, I'd probably grab a Vita, but I'm holding off for now. I have enough games to tide me over, and I suspect the Vita will get some sort of facelift/new discount packaging by Christmas.
That was for Europe, not the U.S. The article also said, "only 7 games" have used it...considering less than 20 games have been released here in the U.S. since it was released...if my quick counting was correct...that's more than 1/3 of games released that have used it, since it released.
ReplyDeletePerhaps looking at what games have used it, how they have sold, and if gamers that use the Circle Pad Pro have said it makes the games/system more comfortable would be important.
Because something doesn't sell well, means it doesn't play well?
ReplyDeleteThat was for Europe, not the U.S. The article also said, "only 7 games" have used it...considering less than 20 games have been released here in the U.S. since it was released...if my quick counting was correct...that's more than 1/3 of games released that have used it, since it released.
ReplyDeletePerhaps looking at what games have used it, how they have sold, and if gamers that use the Circle Pad Pro have said it makes the games/system more comfortable would be important.
http://gonintendo.com/?mode=viewstory&id=179818
ReplyDeleteThat was for Europe, not the U.S. The article also said, "only 7 games" have used it...considering less than 20 games have been released here in the U.S. since it was released...if my quick counting was correct...that's more than 1/3 of games released that have used it, since it released.
ReplyDeletePerhaps looking at what games have used it, how they have sold, and if gamers that use the Circle Pad Pro have said it makes the games/system more comfortable would be important.
"...I suspect the Vita will get some sort of facelift/new discount packaging by Christmas."
ReplyDeleteI'm guessing they'll bundle it with something game wise, like the PS3 is doing Assassin's Creed III bundle.
" It's a tool - not a requirement, in my opinion."
Options = winning. Not having standards, and flailing around throwing duck tape at the console like Nintendo is doing now? Not sure.
"Probably should have gone with a second circle + triggers just to have the appropriate support for future games without a huge CirclePad Pro XL. (which is ridiculous)"
ReplyDeleteRidiculous? It's a great use of plastic, keeps it from landfills around the world, and moves it into people's houses for future generations to use as coffee coasters...INSTANT WIN!
I bet if you saw the 3DS XL's CCP in half, you could get at least two coasters out of it! DOUBLE WIN!
As for, "which reminds me that I should go look at that GameStop spreadsheet again before the sale ends..."
Did you find anything good? I can't believe the ONE game I was going to get, was "UNAVAILABLE". I guess there's always "next time"...
Thanks for the comment/feedback!
I'm keeping my original 3ds until i do a transfer, then i'll trade/sell it. Might even give it to my 5yo nephew who seems to love covering it with his grotty fingerprints already.
ReplyDelete(apparently EB games will do a system transfer in store if you trade your old 3ds's in for a new one)
As for ps3 shooters, I'm still playing Killzone2 and 3. I cant be bothered learning the ropes online with newer games.
I still prefer to play splitscreen (GoldenEye, Rage and Resistance3 keep me happy in that respect)
Ridiculous! I thought my tablet was big, this thing is going to be like holding a wii sideways.
ReplyDeleteGameStop Sale: nah, didn't end up getting anything. The deals were ok saving about $20 from retail with the various combinations I was looking at. Though I decided to take NSMBWii and DKCR out the running. Their price was very close to new and I probably lose the club points thing with used. Will look again in August and see what's going on.
Is this the spot in my post to make irrelevant flaming comments you freakin' fanboy?
Hey Mark, which version of GoldenEye is that? A few of us here have played the Wii version online while back. Hopefully will get back to that sometime soon.
ReplyDeleteROFL - agreed. I just don't get some of the comments on here who act like having the 2nd pad would be a bad thing. It's not like devs would be required to make use of it, but those who do want to have an easy option for adding to their control schemes. One thing that surprised me? The about of Vita hate in these posts. It's like Vita went out and kick a few peoples' puppies or something, it seems so personal, lol
ReplyDeleteI have both versions (Wii and PS3)
ReplyDeleteI prefer the motion controls on the Wii version but I bought a cheap copy of Reloaded on PS3 for the extra MI6 "spec ops" mode. I havent gone online with either version yet (probably wont either) One of my pet peeves is unlocking better guns online just to be competitive.
I miss the old days when everyone was on a level playing field.
I'm much happier playing splitscreen with friends/family.
That's a good point, the XP system for multiplayer is the worst part of the game. I just don't have time to level up and it should really be about teamwork and having fun. Wow, we're quite off-topic from 3DS XL now. :)
ReplyDelete"I miss the old days when everyone was on a level playing field."
ReplyDeleteI was a HUGE fan of the original GoldenEye on the N64, and still own it and play it every once in a while.
"One of my pet peeves is unlocking better guns online just to be competitive."
That would be my one gripe about GoldenEye 007 Wii's online if I have one...it takes FOREVER, FOREVER, FOREVER to level up in the game. I don't mind leveling up, but in GoldenEye Wii it started taking forever.
I was actually interested in the PS3 version because of the MI6 mode, and because I was curious as to if they had fixed the online level up system, but with newer games on the horizon the best it might be is a bargain bin grab one day.
"Wow, we're quite off-topic from 3DS XL now. :)"
ReplyDeleteNot quite...because it can be easily redirected with, "Coffee, the original GoldenEye 64 didn't have two analogue sticks, and once you got used to it, it was fine. If the original GoldenEye didn't need two, neither should FPS games on the 3DS."
My thoughts on the matter:
ReplyDeleteIf the 3DS XL had two extra shoulder buttons and a second analog stick/pad, many more 3DS games would be developed for games that use those extra controls. Thus, current 3DS owners would be forced to purchase a Circle Pad Pro or XL in order to play those games or deal with a very crappy alternate control method, drastically hurting the quality of the games for people who don't have a Circle Pad Pro or 3DS XL.
Also, like it or not, no matter -what-, current 3DS owners would feel terrible with their second-rate 3DS's if the XL offered a second stick and extra shoulder button. It would damage Nintendo's reputation, too. How unprofessional does it look to completely redesign their 3DS and admit that it should have offered those things to begin with?
Secondly, costs are a big issue. Nintendo is trying to regain a profit with 3DS. They would be forced to push the 3DS XL over $200 if it had the analog and shoulder buttons, and Nintendo does not want to ever make a price mistake again. They are in fear of that happening again. The economy of today will not give in to what the economy of 2004 or 2006 would have accepted.
Lastly, Nintendo wants -new- people to buy a 3DS XL. They do not want to tempt people to "upgrade" from their current 3DS's that much, because those kind of sales do not show true growth of the 3DS. Though, adding those extra controls has the potential to attract new buyers as well, but at the same time, adding those extra controls jacks up the price of the console. It get's Nintendo nowhere with new customers, and even pushes away old customers from upgrading.
First, thanks for stopping by and leaving the comment/feedback! I'm going to try and respond by each paragraph...with quoting just a portion of your original to show what I'm responding to.
ReplyDelete"If the 3DS XL had two extra shoulder buttons and a second analog stick/pad, many more 3DS games would be developed for games..."
Again, I don't see it as one of those, "If the 2nd Circle Pad was added, it would make the original system outdated..." things, as a simple control standard could fix that easily, while making the 2nd Circle Pad an option for ALL new systems and opening up the market even more to developers.
"Also, like it or not, no matter -what-, current 3DS owners would feel terrible with their second-rate 3DS's..."
Smaller screen? Less battery life? Smaller 3D viewing area? Those are what current 3DS owners have compared to the XL...the XL is an upgrade in a few areas, and I had paid $250 for the original, I think Nintendo destroyed their own reputation.
As for saying including the 2nd circle pad would make them look unprofessional, the Circle Pad Pro already does that.
"Secondly, costs are a big issue. Nintendo is trying to regain a profit with 3DS. They would be forced to push the 3DS XL over $200 if it had the analog and shoulder buttons..."
If the current 3DS' Circle Pad Pro is only $20, I would imagine that could have been put into the new model for cheaper than an accessory...because they would have been ordering those parts in larger quantities, than limited numbers for an accessory.
If the 3DS XL was announced with a 2nd Circle Pad, and shoulder buttons, at a MSRP of $219.99, I think many would still justify that as a great deal...considering the Vita is currently at $249.99 and $299.99.
"Though, adding those extra controls has the potential to attract new buyers as well, but at the same time, adding those extra controls jacks up the price of the console."
I would have likely paid $220 for a 3DS XL with built in 2nd Circle Pad and shoulder buttons, than I will pay $199.99 for the 3DS XL and then have to buy a $20 accessory to add those features later.
At this point, I may even start looking at used original 3DS systems...and just pick up the Circle Pad Pro for $20. I'm not interested in the 3D effects in the games, so the larger 3D viewing area doesn't matter to me.
Again, a simple control standard of, "Your games must use the touch screen controls, if you are using the 2nd Circle Pad and shoulder buttons controls." The fact is Nintendo doesn't even have 3D standards for the 3DS system, which is another reason I looked at holding off on the purchase as not being a bad thing. STANDARDS of some sort would be nice, and not outdated "remove content from your games" type standards they have on the Wii.
I'm not sure if it would simply be a $20 increase, but I'm not tech savy enough to figure that out haha. I know that either way, Nintendo wanted to keep it under $200 no matter what. In Japan and Europe, they even went as far as to leave out a -charger- of all things just to keep the costs lower. Maybe you would have paid $220 or more for a 3DS XL with a built in Circle Pad Pro, but would others have? The masses?
ReplyDeleteAs I said before as well, many games would be developed with the shoulder buttons and analog in mind. While you can have alternative control methods for non-XL/Pad Pro users, those controls are often very uncomfortable. Comfort is a big thing when it comes to a games quality, so any normal 3DS owners without a Pad Pro are going to get left with a bad control scheme with -too many games-. It would become the standard to have alternate control methods, but Pad Pro games for 3DS already do that, and most people don't like the controls without them (Metal Gear 3D is a good example). It's important to note that the 3DS XL does not replace the current 3DS. The 3DS will still be sold along side it, so it isn't just the current 3DS owners that would suffer - So would future customers of that model. Especially for kids who don't need to be dealing with bad controls.
The 3DS XL that Nintendo has shown already is an option, not an upgrade. Not everyone wants a bigger screen and a bigger system (kids). The main upgrade is the battery life, and that is pretty much it. Having 2 extra shoulder buttons and a second analog wouldn't be an option, nor simply an "upgrade", it would be a revision, and it would make people with their current 3DS's feel "obsolete" on a system that has only been out for a little over a year now.
For the record, what do you mean by "Nintendo doesn't even have a 3D standard for the 3DS system"? Have there been any non-3D 3DS games, or do you mean some 3DS games have better 3D than others?
"Maybe you would have paid $220 or more for a 3DS XL with a built in Circle Pad Pro, but would others have? The masses?"
ReplyDeleteIt depends. If the "masses" were originally interested in the 3DS at $250, perhaps Nintendo wouldn't have looked so unprofessional by dropping its price $80 in only 5 months? Then looking even more unprofessional and looking like they released a rushed product when a magazine, I believe Famitsu, leaked information that Nintendo was releasing the Circle Pad Pro attachment for the system...within 10 months of the system's release.
"By the way, what do you mean by 'Nintendo doesn't even have a 3D standard for the 3DS system'? Have there been any non-3D 3DS games, or do you mean some 3DS games have better 3D than others?"
It was revealed that Nintendo has no 3D standard for the 3DS. Meaning that games can be developed for the system, and have 0% 3D functionality. Personally, I'm not interested in the 3D effects, but if I were to release a "Chicken and Cheese Sandwich for $5.99" and advertise it as such but then say..."Well, we have told the cooks that they don't have to put cheese on it, if they don't feel like it...just make sure to know your cooks." that would make it really just a chicken sandwich, with cheese as an option, even though I charge people for the cheese they may not be getting.
http://www.3dsbuzz.com/nintendo-planning-to-publish-non-3d-3ds-software/
Notice how Mario Kart 3DS, went to Mario Kart 7? Even Nintendo is apparently realizing "the masses" don't care about the 3D gimmick, and is removing "3DS" tags from game titles.
New Super Mario Bros. 2? 2 on a NEW system? What was the last time that happened? New Super Mario Bros. DS, New Super Mario Bros. Wii, New Super Mario Bros. U...but for the 3DS, it's now New Super Mario Bros. 2.
As for, "As I said before as well, many games would be developed with the shoulder buttons and analog in mind. While you can have alternative control methods for non-XL/Pad Pro users, those controls are often very uncomfortable. Comfort is a big thing when it comes to a games quality, so any normal 3DS owners without a Pad Pro are going to get left with a bad control scheme with -too many games-."
As I said before, a simple control standard would have solved the 2nd Circle Pad/shoulder buttons option. Good developers would make good controls, bad developers well...just hope the masses know their developers the same with the 3D standard for the system.
Again though, if Nintendo was REALLY worried about not looking unprofessional, and worried about not alienating fans, they wouldn't release a system and drop its price within months of the systems release...but this is at least the second time Nintendo has done it, which doesn't reflect well on them for supposedly protecting early adopters.
I mean, if current 3DS owners aren't the target audience, and they released the DSi XL only a year before the 3DS was released, does that mean we will see a new one next year? "The Nintendo DS 2CC" where they get rid of the 3D screen, and just add the 2nd Circle Pad and shoulder buttons, since better control options would hopefully have better games, and not some 3D gimmick that does little/nothing in games and that Nintendo is getting away from apparently advertising?
nonsense troll
ReplyDeleteit didnt
ReplyDeletestop trolling
ReplyDeletestop trolling
ReplyDeletesuch a troll article
ReplyDeleteGiving the 3DS XL a second circle pad, would alienate the 3DS owners who bought the regular version. I'm glad they didn't. Most games so far have been fine without it, IMO.
ReplyDeleteStating truth isn't trolling. Nintendo doesn't have a 3D standard for the 3DS, and having one control standard wouldn't alienate original owners.
ReplyDeleteTrolling = using two names, and not discussing actual points brought up? Or, no?
LOL, yes you are...not discussing actual points...
ReplyDeleteSo, was my point right or wrong? Or, do you not actually care to inform people about your claims? Either you have to have both systems to transfer, or you don't. I have only seen evidence to show you must have both systems, original and new, to transfer the data.
ReplyDeleteSuch a great comment. Adding much to the discussion. LOVE IT. By the way, please stay out of the sun. :)
ReplyDeleteFirst, thanks for stopping by and commenting!
ReplyDeleteAs for the "alienate the 3DS owners who bought the regular version.", I think that could be solved very easily with a control standard for the system.
If a game is using the new additional Circle Pad (and/or shoulder buttons), it must have an alternative touch screen controls.
So, touch screen controls would be the standard controls still for the system, with the Circle Pad as an option.
I vehmantly disagree. Imagine how all the 3DS (original version) would have felt if suddenly Nintendo releases a new one that is not only larger but includes a second circle pad? Especially if suddenly tons of developers started making games that required both. Now the owners of the original 3DS HAVE to go buy a stupid Circle Pad Pro.
ReplyDeleteThank GOODNESS that not only are developers not developing games that require a second circle pad, but that Nintendo didn't cave under pressure to include one in the XL. A second circle pad is pretty pointless, actually, when everything that it would bring can already otherwise be done by people who are willing to think beyond an Xbox controller and just enjoy games.
Sorry Coffee you have to deal with some of the comments. I know where you stand in this gaming world. So I can understand your point of view on this matter. The main thing I want to say is this is revision or redesign. This is another option. Nintendo will not be discontinuing the smalller 3DS for the bigger one. Making a new model or redesign after one year on the market. Would just piss off your US market who already aren't buying your system. This move is more for Japan, and to for those who like bigger screens. People with bad eye sight, or just wanted a bigger viewing area. Also Japan has a new Brain Age coming this year. Which will benefit from the bigger screen because the current 3Ds doesn't work so well with those games. FPS have not shown yet they are a genre that can sale handhelds. So adding it for those games is not a sure thing. Also games like Monster Hunter Tri G in Japan have already proven. They can be played better than their PSP counterparts by using the touch screen. So while it could have been added it's not something that really needs to be added.
ReplyDeletewhere are the extra shoulder buttons from circle pad pro this design wont work!!! and also the reason the 3ds does not have two sticks
ReplyDeleteThey are there, you just can't see them in these images... ;)
ReplyDelete"...the additional circle pad makes the already announced 3DS XL Circle Pad Pro a non-issue, and new shoulder buttons will be able to be implemented as well"
Thanks for stopping by!
You can't have the power button located on the raised ridge directly underneath the left screen bumper unless you want the 3DS powering off every time you shut the lid.
ReplyDeleteNow here's my thing, and I've talked to my local Nintendo Rep regarding it. Though I think this Bigger version might be a little soon (as a Day 1 3DS owner) but highly welcomed (Since I work video game retail and there are uninformed customers that see the 3DS as another DS redesign and claim the DSiXL was superior because of the larger screen).
ReplyDeleteBut I expressed that I was glad that the 3DSXL doesn't have an additional Circle pad. For one, it would essentially render all current 3DS owners obsolete, because it would eliminate the "Optional" portion of the 2nd Circle pad.
Two adding it and still releasing the 3DSXL at 199 would completely cannibalize 3DS sales. 3DS + Circle pad pro (169.99+19.99) = 189.99. $10 more, why not buy a 3DSXL that has one built in. But release the XL with a second circle pad at 219.99 makes a consumer difference.
"I vehmantly disagree. Imagine how all the 3DS (original version) would have felt if suddenly Nintendo releases a new one that is not only larger but includes a second circle pad?"
ReplyDeletePerhaps the same way many felt when Nintendo dropped the price by $80 and announced the Circle Pad Pro within a few months of the original console releasing?
Again, a simple control standard solves any problem of alienating original 3DS buyers and makes it more appealing to someone like myself, that would prefer the console be "one" unit instead of having to add accessories to my console to make it play certain games more comfortably.
"Also games like Monster Hunter Tri G in Japan have already proven. They can be played better than their PSP counterparts by using the touch screen. So while it could have been added it's not something that really needs to be added."
ReplyDeleteJust because it doesn't have to have it, doesn't mean it shouldn't though. I mean Nintendo doesn't even have 3D standards for the 3DS, yet they charge consumers for a 3D screen that may not even be used, or used well.
Monster Hunter Tri 3G was released in Japan, the same exact day that Nintendo released the Circle Pad Pro in Japan. I really wonder how many units it has sold in Japan, versus the U.S. etc., but when I looked I didn't see those numbers (if you have them, I would love to see the breakdown).
I mean, I don't see who this appeals to, as I don't have a 3DS and it doesn't make me want to go buy it. If anything, it makes me glad that hopefully the original 3DS will drop in price for used systems, and I can pick one up dirt cheap (may go to GameStop and offer $10 more in cash than their trade-in value around the 3DS XL launch, if I think about it).
A 3DS for under $100, and add the Circle Pad Pro for just $20. Not too shabby if that could happen.
The top screen wouldn't touch it in the new design, as the shell closes just high enough over the power button to not be an issue. ;)
ReplyDeleteEverything would be perfect with it. It would even be able to make my coffee pot turn on from another room with built in software.
"For one, it would essentially render all current 3DS owners obsolete, because it would eliminate the "Optional" portion of the 2nd Circle pad."
ReplyDeleteNot with a control standard. Nintendo could concentrate on game-play standards, instead of things like requiring developers to remove extra content as they have done on the Wii:
http://www.coffeewithgames.com/2011/04/fps-friday-feature-interview-greg.html
As for, "Two adding it and still releasing the 3DSXL at 199 would completely cannibalize 3DS sales. 3DS + Circle pad pro (169.99+19.99) = 189.99."
I don't think so, because since May, most major retailers have offered $20 gift cards with the purchase of a new 3DS system. That immediately offsets the Circle Pad Pro price for original 3DS owners.
Thanks for stopping by and commenting! I appreciate the thoughts!
I they added a second slide pad, they'd have to add ZLZR buttons to accomodate the Circle pad pro on the original 3DS, making the XL even thicker.
ReplyDeleteNo thanks.
Are you a current 3DS owner, upgrading to the 3DS XL? Or, will you be buying a new 3DS XL making that your first 3DS system to own?
ReplyDeleteI run the Video Games section at my Best Buy and the $20 GC is not really a valid statement. Most of the time those card offers is money come from the retailers pockets. Unless its something like a Vendor (Nintendo) funded sale, retailers on average make only around $6 off a 3DS at full price.
ReplyDeleteAlso you can offer control standards but given that, if the system is built with the extra control method, wouldn't all adopters of the system feel awkward that whats there is barely used at all, like the D-Pad on the N64 controller?
How does, "I run the Video Games section at my Best Buy and the $20 GC is not really a valid statement. Most of the time those card offers is money come from the retailers pockets. Unless its something like a Vendor (Nintendo) funded sale, retailers on average make only around $6 off a 3DS at full price."
ReplyDeletemake my statement, "because since May, most major retailers have offered $20 gift cards with the purchase of a new 3DS system. That immediately offsets the Circle Pad Pro price for original 3DS owners." not valid?
$20 gift cards have been offered pretty regularly by Best Buy, Target, and Toys "R" US since May for the 3DS system. If a consumer gets a $20 gift card, that off sets the price of the Circle Pad Pro...even though it is only offered through GameStop right now. It doesn't matter if they are "Vendor" or retailer funded gift cards, the consumer is still getting the discount.
Unless you're saying because the current 3DS system doesn't have a $20 gift card offer every single week at Best Buy?
As for, "...wouldn't all adopters of the system feel awkward that whats there is barely used at all, like the D-Pad on the N64 controller?"
Can't the same be said for the 3D cameras for video recording, online functionality, and 3D effects in games on the system though? Nintendo doesn't even have 3D standards for the 3DS, effectively selling a product with a feature that isn't even required to be used by developers. At least an alternative control method would be designed to make things more comfortable when gaming, whereas the 3D screen...it seems very hit/miss with 3DS owners.
Prospective 3ds buyer here that likes the redesign and would choose it over the original model.
ReplyDeleteMy gamer consumer profile:
I am apparently not a current generation gamer anymore and do not favor the complexity of twin sticks and too many buttons. I am not a big fan of fps but enjoy a wide variety of genres outside of it and sports. The added size of the unit is not a problem for me as a good deal of my DS gaming is done at home...I am also the type that often carries a man bag or backpack around for laptops and such. The 3ds XL thus seems geared for my consumer segment ...the $20 premium will be worth the larger screens and increased comfortability...I suspect the larger memory card will prove meaningless however as retail games are made downloadable.
Honest question: given that I do not play many games that require two control sticks for optimum playability, what is the second stick generally used for? My notion is that it controls the user camera (which in a fps would determine weapon aim)..would a combination of touch screen and gyro functions not replace the second stick in these cases for a game that is designed to utilize the control scheme?
As an example, I have heard many different opinions on the otherwise excellent looking RE Revelaitons...some swear the lack of the second slider renders it very uncomfortable to play whereas others have shrugged and said it plays like the trusty RE 4 and have reported no significant issues. Kid Icarus would be another interesting example as a game that some users have decried for not having some second stick control lability.
That is an interesting design question however...to fully reproduce the Circle Pad Pro in this new unit, the extra shoulder buttons would seem to necessitate a thicker base unit.
ReplyDeleteTheir are other ways to design it of course....they could resculpt the bottom half along the lines of what They did for the Wii Pad and set triggers along with more natural contoured grooves for the hand. This would probably destroy the aesthetic for many users however, jokes about the current unit lacking any plus aesthetics aside.
Nintendo could also shrink the size of the triggers....this would almost certainly lead to complaints about cramped layout however.
They could align four buttons in a row along the top! We have never seen this design before but maybe it is workable and satisfies the demand for more buttons among some customers.
Yet another option would be to revisit the analog - digital click mechanism used in some controllers where a click down of. The button registers as the second input for each button.
As Nintendos hardware labs likely employ a number of talented and experienced engineers, they have probably built all of these half-brained solutions and many more. I wonder if they influence the final decision on control layouts or if someone above dictates the layout and they just handle the arrangement and composition?
Because the $20 Giftcard doesnt really offset the price of ccp because it is a retailer exclusive. And also because most of the time the $20 GC deal is typically a market reaction, either from matching competitors deals or because they got high inventory counts and have to find a way to move products.
ReplyDeleteLooking at it from a business standpoint, and Nintendo is a Business, just makes no sense. Also given that Nintendo wants to keep costs as low as possible for the thing, only US XL's coming with an AC adapter, which would be more essential than a CCP, it would still make the thing more expensive. And anything higher than $199 for a Handheld just isnt attractive.
I'm not sure why we're still discussing a $20 GC. Regardless of retailer exclusive, it nets you $20 that would otherwise come out of your pocket. How that expense actually shakes out doesn't matter.
ReplyDeleteI would be in the same boat if I didn't already buy one. (original 3DS)
ReplyDeleteAs for RE:R I haven't demoed it in months, but thought it was still very playable without the CCP. In contrast Metal Gear Solid Snake Eater 3D felt very awkward without a second stick/circle which turned me off of it.
Gyro would probably help with those kinds of controls, but I suspect may get rather tiring after awhile. Personally I don't mind _some_ gyro, but get tired of the gimmick and don't feel like moving the 3DS around. (plus if there's' too much movement you lose your "3D window") When looking at Spirit Camera that was one of the things that influenced my decision to not buy.
"Honest question: given that I do not play many games that require two control sticks for optimum playability, what is the second stick generally used for?"
ReplyDeleteCamera control in games, not just FPS games, but 3D adventures/platformers such as Zelda and Mario games.
Monster Hunter Tri 3G probably the best example? It's the game the Circle Pad Pro was originally released with in Japan. Monster Hunter Tri 3G is also the best selling 3rd party game on the 3DS system, and it's only out in Japan right now. I just don't know what the attach rate is for the game/Circle Pad Pro attachment.
As for Kid Icarus, like you, I have heard complaints/praises on both sides for the game.
"would a combination of touch screen and gyro functions not replace the second stick in these cases for a game that is designed to utilize the control scheme?"
Yea, gyro/touch and the current L/R buttons can be used for camera controls in 3D games, but for me it goes back to comfort and not having to reach to the touchscreen while playing. I played through Dementium II on the DS (FPS horror type titled) and really enjoyed the game, but kept thinking, "Hmm, this would be a lot more comfortable with another control option."
Again, the game itself was fun and I completed it, but I can see how/why a second circle pad would possibly allow for a more comfortable time playing the game.
Thanks for stopping by, and leaving the comment/feedback! Also, if price is a consideration, you could always look to the used 3DS market of the original, as I'm guessing those prices will be coming down here soon, and save more than the original $30 over the new price differences. It's something I'm considering now.
"That is an interesting design question however...to fully reproduce the Circle Pad Pro in this new unit, the extra shoulder buttons would seem to necessitate a thicker base unit."
ReplyDeleteYea, if the base was thicker, it wouldn't probably matter to those that want a 2nd Circle Pad though, as they will be buying the Circle Pad Pro making the console thicker (and wider). Being ergonomically designed is important though, or should be.
"Nintendo could also shrink the size of the triggers....this would almost certainly lead to complaints about cramped layout however."
Yea, I was thinking a split L/R they have now, could work, but the "cramped" thing could be an issue...
It just seems that ergonomic design isn't the first thing Nintendo thinks of when designing new controllers/handhelds necessarily...the Classic Controller on the Wii quickly comes to mind.
As for rearraning the ABXY buttons, I think they have stuck with the layout most are familiar with since the SNES, not exact, but close.
I wonder if there is an absolute, "NO!" or general "NO!" rule when designing a console/controller at Nintendo and doing the button layout...*sends out secret fly to find the documents, watches fly get eaten by bird in the backyard!
Perhaps we'll never know.
As for one design I was thinking, making it thicker in the back to add the additional shoulder buttons could be interesting. I thought something like the shape below could work...thicker at the back, thinner toward the front.
Again, thanks for stopping by!
Robert: Great point about gyro potentially shattering the 3d window. That was one of the funny things about the systems design...how several aspects of it seemed so unfriendly to 3d! REvelaitons vs Metal Gear: I have heard quite a bit about what a disappointing effort Konami made with that game...and I have seen the disappointing sales numbers. Guess there goes my fantasy of a rebuilt MG Ghost Babel...funny thing is a good Metal Gear game doesn't necessarily need the complex camera in my book...oh well.
ReplyDeleteCoffee: interesting remark about Zelda and Mario 3d camera use. Zelda has gotten around the issue with the z trigger mechanism, with different camera modes depending on situation. For me, it worked OK (haven't played Skyward Sword so maybe they have changed it).
Original 3d Mario allowed a degree of camera control with the c-buttons which I remember being an ok solution. Mario Type action however is not as demanding perhaps as a Uncharted or God of War. Still, as I have not played Galaxy or 3d Land, it makes me wonder how they Solved the camera problem in those well received games.
This leads to me a larger point about where the real barrier for great controls lies: on the hard plastic of the controller itself, at the feet of the developers who create the systems of player control or the users themselves who become attached to their own ingrained concept of what is necessary for great controls (and this changes depending on the user!).
No doubt that more buttons and more sticks, gyros and touchscreens allow for a greater range of control options...and the trade off is complexity, how many options does a user really need or can process before the game becomes too complex (and thus serves a dramatically smaller and smaller audience)?
Users I feel can be guilty of myopia when evaluating the usefulness of different control schemes...I can see many comments now across a range of forums that decry motion based controls or touch screen controls as gimmicks. To my mind each input system gains strength according to context...in game contexts, certain games work better with different input systems (no doubt platforming games are not as satisfying on a touchscreen, but RPGs have been terrific).
This leads to developers because their designs will influence the game experience more than anything else. 3d Mario and Zelda from yesteryear tell me that a good control system can be layered in with the right design...but shoddiest efforts will result in something less satisfactory, like 3ds Metal Gear and have users wishing for extra circle pads.
Whoops I'm way off topic. Back to 3ds, I see an official price drop of the OG system incoming but in typical Nintendo fashion will depend on market considerations. Nintendo would have already announced if a price drop would coincide with the XL release but I believe they want to see the splits through the holidays. If the higher margin XL significantly outsells the OG, we will see a price drop sooner rather than later. If the split is more even Nintendo will probably hold steady through spring.
I think the XL is such a step above the OG that I am anticipating a large split from here on....there should indeed be some great deals on used OG units forthcoming but dude, those are some BIG screens!
"Users I feel can be guilty of myopia when evaluating the usefulness of different control schemes...I can see many comments now across a range of forums that decry motion based controls or touch screen controls as gimmicks."
ReplyDeleteHaha, I actually enjoy motion controls. I prefer FPS games with Wii Remote and Nunchuk controls because I feel like when they are done well, they add to the game-play experience, and do not take away from it.
As for the touch screen controls, I only have experience with one FPS game on the original DS, and I just found it uncomfortable holding the DS with one hand, while trying to use the touch screen with the other. While the game was fun, playing it for longer times was just uncomfortable.
"...there should indeed be some great deals on used OG units forthcoming but dude, those are some BIG screens!"
LOL, they are, but I don't see like the additional $30 for them (see definition of cheap), when I'm more interested in the controls and getting the Circle Pad Pro which will cost me an extra $20.
A 2nd Circle Pad on the system, with one standard control (touch screen) while giving developers the option for both, would have been great. Now though, the remainder of the 3DS' life will be like Wii MotionPlus. If it's not included from the start, don't expect developers to use it.
Monster Hunter Tri 3G was the game the Circle Pad Pro released for, and I think it was so the game would be more comfortable for longer hours of playing...but I'm not sure how it was received in Japan. I would be interested to find out though.
Yeah, I do wish Nintendo was confident enough in the Wii (and don't get me wrong, releasing the thing in the first place showed some ginormous corporate balls!) to build in the Motion+ right from the start.
ReplyDeleteVersus the Circle Pad Pro I think there is a particularly big difference with their raison d'etre. With the Motion+, Nintendo wanted to realize the true promise of motion controls by augmenting the tech and they backed that up with quality software (ultimately too little, too little but yeh). They went so far as to bundle the Motion+ in with perhaps their most expensive game project ever, Skyward Sword.
The Circle Pad Pro, like the Classic Controller Pro, was developed and distributed with entirely different intentions. Indeed, it was created for Monster Hunter, and Nintendo's decisions since then have driven home the point that they intend to trivialize the add-on as a "one-trick pony" of sorts:
-none of their games support CPP, not even a flagship game like Icarus that perhaps could have really benefited.
-their distribution of the device was extremely limited and I now wonder if, like Xenoblade, Gamestop themselves approached NOA to bring over the beast.
-most tellingly of course, the 3DS XL design guarantees the platform is intended to be single Circle-Padded for at least another year.
I have noticed a number of comments saying something along the lines of: "guess I'll wait for the Next revision that includes CPP!"...but I wonder if that possibility is now more remote than ever? Splintering the user-base over 3 years into the platform's product life, with its successor liking looming in another year, seems like a poor decision on Ninty's part. Also, since Nintendo seemingly doesn't make dual-stick games, Who would support the extra stick functionality by then?
I don't know if another 3DS model in the next year-half is even feasible. The XL already has the larger screens so where can they take it (since the direction is always upscale so they can reap thicker margins on new hardware)? maybe they can give it a unibody aluminum enclosure and slightly better cameras ;p
ANYWAYS...have you taken a look at Nyko's Power Grip Pro? Its like a power-suit for your 3DS:
http://www.engadget.com/2012/06/05/nyko-power-grip-pro-3ds/
~THAT~ is how to make a CPP add-on.
"ANYWAYS...have you taken a look at Nyko's Power Grip Pro? Its like a power-suit for your 3DS:"
ReplyDeleteI have actually! It's probably the one I would go with, as the added battery life feature is super nice IMO.
Real fast, about your WM+ point, it apparently wasn't ready for the Wii's launch (which I do think is true), and is why they released it later as an add on, and now built in.
Did you see the Iwata interview, posted up about the 3DS XL not including a second analogue stick? It was posted up just a few days ago:
http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/gaming/satoru-iwata-on-wii-u-i-think-it-will-become-increasingly-difficult-from-now-on-to-compete-over-graphics-7936301.html
Thanks for the continued feedback!
I like the redesign you have pictured and its something I had in mind, myself. I'm honestly surprised Nintendo didn't include a second screen with the 3DS so they could have an accessory attachment... lol.
ReplyDeleteEither way, I'm happy with my 3DS, only because I paid $120 for it, but still laugh when I see that ugly brick-like peripheral that serves only one purpose that could have easily been added to the 3DS itself... that being a second thumb stick, which is an awesome design choice they snagged from the PSP and improved upon.
3DS basically went with the button layout of a previous gen handheld... the PSP. And, I really wish they would have done something like the Vita.
This comment made me laugh due to its author's stupidity.
ReplyDeleteThere would be a problem adding a second circle pad to the 3ds. It's supposed to be a different version of the same portable, if they added a feature that was included in one version then game developers could develop games that require the use of two circle pads, resulting in those who have a regular 3ds being unable to play the game. This would cause a weird situation where the 3ds is still being sold, but no one would buy it.
ReplyDeleteSorry, just seeing this comment, 9 months later!
ReplyDeleteI'm guessing that with the GamePad design, if they turn the Wii U sales/system situation around, that their next handheld might have two thumb sticks to make it more cross compatible, sort of like what Sony has going on with the PS Vita and PS3 cross play.
Thanks for the comment and feedback! Sorry I missed this one when you first made it.
I understand that people wish Nintendo did 2 Circle Pads, but after trying the Circle Pad Pro.... it's a little weird. I think they should consider analog sticks in future. It all depends on how they go with next-gen really. I fully understand why they went with the C-Stick, but I can't say much due to not trying it, Not sure why I'm commenting on a old article lol
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